Shinohara Cip3 help

[Ryciukas]

Good evening, what software do you use to generate the sip3 file?

Hello Danyrton.
We are using Prinect MetaDimension 2016. It has built-in CIP3 generator.

 

[Camilo]

Hello everyone,

I´ve found your thread looking for a solution to replace my shinohara 75 IVP yr2006 faulty floppy drive, I´ve bought a floppy usb emulator but didn´t work and I have some inquiries for you if you may please help me,
- What´s the difference beetween the original Teac FD-235HG C817 installed and a regular FDD? I tried with an standard drive from an old PC and didn´t work neither
- does anyone have the Shinohara Cip3 Station installer?
- if I had only floppy drive would it be possible for me to connect through the serial port you are talking about?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

best regards

 

[Ryciukas]

Hi Camilo,
if I remember correctly, it seems that it is FDD in diagrams, but unfortunately I don't have them at home, I will take a look tomorrow. But it is strange that the 2006 press still uses FDD. Our press is connected via serial connector directly to the serial port of the computer of press, to the controller on the feed side. There are two inputs - one comes from the console, another - from PC. Tomorrow I will look at the schematics, I hope problem will be solved.

 

[Camilo]

Hi Ryciucas,

thank you, would it be too much to ask for pics of the serial connectors? If you may help me I’m thinking right now on installing shino cip3 station on a pc, connecting it the way you say and forget about floppies

best regards

 

[Ryciukas]

Yes Sir
I have photos and schematics of all you need, also cables, just have in mind there must be equipment on you press ready for serial connection. Will replay tomorrow.
Best regards.

 

[Camilo]

Thanks so much , I’ll be impatiently waiting

 

[Ryciukas]

Hi Camilo.
So. Yes I found FDD on wiring sheet, this is little different from my equipment.
My console and PC are both connected to Omron CPU43H, and this CPU through delivery side board manages ink motors.
If your press has same CPU43H on feed side board, I think you can make cable, install CIP3 uploader to PC and try to operate. You'll need older PC or notebook with COM port. Also possible to use USB-COM adapter, which has Prolific chip inside. I tried, it is working perfect. I'm using Windows7. Not tried other WIN. Attached some images, also drawing of the cable, do not try other COM cables, it will not work and can damage PC. It will be complicated to communicate, because of time zone, Lithuania is +8 hours from Bogotá.

 

[Camilo]

Hi Ryciukas,

Yes my CPU is the same, pls take a look to the pic, so I´ll just forget the FDD and give the cable a try, in your image which color arrow is the notebook connected? if I do it will the console be overriden?
I´ve found a PL2303 cable online, is that the kind of cable you are using? But considering my press layout I´ll need a 12 mt (40ft) long cable, how long is yours?

many many thanks

 

[Ryciukas]

In my picture of CPU there is BLUE cable from Console, and RED is directly from CIP3 PC. I see you have both cables connected, so I think no need to buy another cable, just find another end of it. I believe it goes to "pc" located inside console, and enough just to connect it to external PC running CIP3 software. You must open connector to check it wired as in cable scheme. COM cable must not exceed 15 meters and must be shielded. I did not bought cable, I bought shielded 3-wires cable and connectors and soldered it myself. And placed it inside plastic armor.
THEORY: CIP3 function works this way: 1. if you press some ink level adjustment button on console, it sends signal to CPU, and CPU sends signal to delivery board (located below powder box), and delivery board manages corresponding ink valve. 2. If you open CIP3 file on PC and press "upload" to press, all data goes directly to CPU, CPU sends this data to Console, and you must confirm uploading ink levels by pressing button on console, then the console takes the values from the file and sets the ink levels accordingly through delivery board. Later it is still necessary to adjust by hand, in our case it is almost always necessary to raise the general level.
So for now just find other end of cable (I think it is inside console) and make sure soldering inside is correct.
Must leave. Will be back later today.

 

[Camilo]

Well I´ve find 2 of the 3 rs232 cables connected to the CPU, they get into the board on the pic I´m sending but can´t find the 3rd, so as you say I hope that´s the one, my press is close to a wall so it´s kind of uncomfortable to check it, i´ll be removing some covers to do it and will tell you as soon as I find out.
Thank you

 

[Camilo]

Hello Ryciukas,

No luck, please check the attached pic explaining where the connectors go, from the cpu, 2 cables go to the panel on the delivery and drive side I´ve sent you before and the third one goes to the operation panel on delivery.

Any ideas?

 

[Ryciukas]

Hi Camilo. Did you checked cables physically or using multimeter, or only by text markers on connectors? It seems very close to wiring diagram but looks bit different, I think it is a bit older. Anyway, you can make a try. Disconnect cyan cable both sides and use multimeter to make sure wiring conforms cable diagram I attached before. Then connect to cpu side, but cable connector from delivery board connect to notebook or external pc com port. Before it, open pc hardware control panel and make sure you see com ports. CIP occupies first free port when installing, best if it will be com1. If used port has higher number, open it and change number to 1. When you ready, send private message to me. Regards.

 

[Camilo]

Hello Ryciukas,

We physically checked the connections, as I told you it was kind of difficult, removing the drive side platforms was a must but we could follow the cable from point to point, I’ll check the wiring, but may I ask, if I use the “pc” our “cyan cable” will that disable my current console?

I’ll be in touch as soon as I’m able to do it, we have Holy Week holidays until next Monday 2023-03-10

And Your help is greatly appreciated, best regards.

 

[Ryciukas]

Sounds good. I wrote above how ink levels managing works, so console will not be disabled.
Console (operator) is the Boss here, you can't disable console. PC is just an assistant, only transfers ppf data for ink level to console, nothing more. Then Operator accepts or rejects this data (on touch screen). If accepts - console will adjusts levels; if rejects - nothing happens. In your case you simply need to try use external PC instead of integrated one. I don't know your console hardware so I can't tell you exactly how to do it. You just try cyan or magenta cables
My console hardware is bit newer and bit different, there is no computer inside my console, as you have. We used external PC from the day the press was installed.
OK. I wish you happy holidays
P.S. I will be on vacation from April 10 until May 02, so I won't be able to help.

 

[Martin Mueller]

Hello everyone,

I´ve found your thread looking for a solution to replace my shinohara 75 IVP yr2006 faulty floppy drive, I´ve bought a floppy usb emulator but didn´t work and I have some inquiries for you if you may please help me,
- What´s the difference beetween the original Teac FD-235HG C817 installed and a regular FDD? I tried with an standard drive from an old PC and didn´t work neither
- does anyone have the Shinohara Cip3 Station installer?
- if I had only floppy drive would it be possible for me to connect through the serial port you are talking about?

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

best regards

Hi Camilo,

I have read that you need the installer of the Shinohara CIP3Station. The installer package is unfortunately too big for transfering here. Please send me a valid email address and I can send you the 7z-compressed installer by transfernow.net.

Best regards
Martin

 

[Camilo]

Hi Martin,

Thanks for your help, I’ve already sent a pm message to you,

best regards

 

[Camilo]

Hello Everyone,

I could do it! I´m so happy, thanks to the great Help of Ryciukas and Martin on the software, here is how it was done:

- The cable as advised by Ricyukas was checked and it was wired accordingly to his diagram, so no extra cable was needed, the Serial_USB interface with prolific chipset luckily I had it from a densitometer connection I never used, so after connected I got a 025 error on the Cip3 Station that was fixed following Ryciukas #37 post.

Now I can sent the ink levels directly from file to press.

ps. I still have the floppy drive damaged, with the COM connection would be possible to save the ink levels without a floppy disk? after the preset levels we want to save the final adjustments.

 

[Ryciukas]

Hello Everyone,

I could do it! I´m so happy, thanks to the great Help of Ryciukas and Martin on the software, here is how it was done:

- The cable as advised by Ricyukas was checked and it was wired accordingly to his diagram, so no extra cable was needed, the Serial_USB interface with prolific chipset luckily I had it from a densitometer connection I never used, so after connected I got a 025 error on the Cip3 Station that was fixed following Ryciukas #37 post.

Now I can sent the ink levels directly from file to press.

ps. I still have the floppy drive damaged, with the COM connection would be possible to save the ink levels without a floppy disk? after the preset levels we want to save the final adjustments.

Hi Camilo. After final ink level adjustment on console for specific job (PPF+manual), you only can save final values using control panel of console, save into internal memory of console, and you can retrieve them as needed. No way to export them.

 

[Martin Mueller]

@ Camilo
here are attached two screenshots from PressPerCent about Shinohara file formats RSH and SRI.