Ink Build Up on Impression Cylinders

Hi guys,
Is there any solution to prevent ink buildup on Impression Cylinder?

 

Are you talking about ink on the sides of the sheet ?
The printed side (the one you now print) faces the blanket so it is not facing the Impression cylinder unless you have a perfecting press and ofter the perfector the first side will face the next impression cylinders.

If it is the sides you are talking about , you may have too much pressure or over packing so the nlanket is pressed to the cylinder and gets it dirty.

are you using a HD / Komori ?
how do you set your pressure ?

 

You should do some check ups firstly check squeeze between the blanket and impression cylinder. If the squeeze is too tight can cause piling, as well as too much dot gain.Impression squeeze should be adopted just enough for you to have good transfer of ink fro blanket to paper.Also we use some spray for cleaning cylinders and they also prevent ink-build up in future you can easily find them .

 

@Meny, I'm running a SM 102 6 color. I agree with you that its too much pressure, but when I pack the blankets as per manufacturers specs, I do'nt get a good print result, so I pack 0.15mm more to get good impression. May be bcoz of bad impression cylinder jackets.
Our consumable supplier told me about some product that we can apply on impression cylinders to reduce this ink buildup.
@Saso. can you tell me about that spray?

 

Ok , so it is a perfecting press.
if you need to clean the jackets , the best stuff to do so is "resil2000" , this will renew your jackets very nice , but you should check if it is not about time to simply change them to new.
I know the originals cost like they made od Gold , but reasonable priced and good quality is available too. about 35% of original price.
Change the jackets and you have some years of better printing..... no shorts cuts in print...

 

aqazi81
Hold on, questions first, before pointing the finger at one area. Are all the cylinders getting ink build up, or just the one or two cylinders ? What type of etch are you using, is it phosphate free? Do you run with or without alcohol? What type of ink and do you use a reducer ? How old are the rollers ? Background tinting you don't see on one sheet, but after a few thousand impressions it shows on the blanket and the impression cylinder, print clean and maybe the ink build up won't happen. Have you ever gone a shift lifted the catwalk and looked at the impression and said it's not dirty so I don't have to clean it, I have, for 3 days in a row. When a press is tuned proper and a great combination of ink and etch printing is easy. Supplier feed on your problems, you have to take their info and use it to your advantage not their's, they would sell you everything under the sun and hope your problem comes back in 3 months to sell you everything all over again.
FSA

 

agazi81
check the company Varn they have ICC(Impression cylinder cleaner) or something like that or go to their home page they are under Flint Group.

 

@ FSA.... Yes all the cylinders have this problem.....I m running with alcohol...basically here in Pakistan, Most Print Shop owners go for the cheapest consumables available in the market...low quality inks and consumables from Korea or China and still they want the top quality printing
@meny....Its a perfector... 2/4.
How much an after market cylinder jacket would cost?

 

So my friend , you did every thing against the pakistany way
You took a perfector as your press and you work with Alcohol.....
but it is the right way - now you only need to solve the current problems and you have a winning horse.

A good jacket for a Heidelberg will cost about 650 Euro , half the cost of the original and yet as good.
a poor jacket can cost you about 400 Euro and it is not worth it.
The jackets have a life span - the formal # is about 30 million , some hold them for 50 , 70 , 90 , but , the more you hold it , the more you need to do more maintenance to keep it running and you need to do it more often . the issue is that then you stop the press all the time and time= money , you waist your press time - you waist money.
so change the jackets to new onesw , give them good maintenance (do not wait until they are done , maintain the all the time) and you get better result.

The pressure should not be over the one designed for the press - if you bend the rulls of the press , at some stage it will bend your hand back.
Remember , the best stuff to use to clean and maintain the jackets is Resil 2000.
I am 99% sure you can not buy it in pakistan and you will need to order. it is not cheap , but it is cheaper then stopping all the time to clean and cheaper then new jackets.
Once you have your press right , you can get back to the right pressure and keep your cylinders clean on longer runs.

And one last point - You are in Pakistan , i am In israel , and we can still help each other as humans.....
Keep well\
meny

 

one more important point

Hiw do you know you have the right ink on your sheet ?
do you work to density ?
if you use cheap / poor ink , have the second to best water system , and have bad jackets , it is a miracle you can get any sheets out to look good
If you work right , you will find it not only saves you money , but you will pay more for what you use , yet make more money at the same time to compensate for it ++++
I can not come to visit you , but willing to help with the right way to improve- talk to me any time - you have my tel# from the past.

 

@Meny... If we are printing according to the approved sample by the print buyer, then everything is ok.... No Density measurement... no Dot gain....no grey balance...This is the Pakistani way.... I've been in this field for about 12 years now and I've seen Densitometre being used in just 1 print shop, and they didnt even knew how to use it properly.....and that Print shop is closed now...lolz.
And thanx for your support..... Yes we are humans....

 

That's the point , the fact that what you prints suits ypur customer is not proof that it is printed RIGHT.
May be the dots on the plate will enable you to get the result the customer wants but at a wrong ink load.
Then . if you have too much ink , and the ink is a rather cheap one , and the chemistry is not the very best..... then you can get ink deposits on your jackets much faster.
Once your sheets are out in the delivery - how long before the ink is dry ? real dry ?
AS FAR AS I CAN SEE , and i am too far away to realy see , you have a combination of problems:
1. jackets that need a deep clean or replacing
2. low quality ink & chemistry
3. unknown ink levels
4. too much pressure / packing
each one of the above cab give you the problem you have , but just to make sure... you have got them all.....

Take them one by one , solve them and forget the problem

 

Add one more thing... Bad rollers...But Meny one thing to mention here is that all of the technology that u have in your countries, but still there is always a place for a good pressman, who knows printing, not just operating a state of the art press. Am I right?

 

100%
A bad press state with a good pressman - still some hope
A bad press with a no knowledge operator - deeeep ****

CIP3 (since 1995) , Densitometers , , closed loop , all are very nice to have & helpfull.

But the Technology that seems to wrong on yoiur press is not Gadgets only...
Bad jackets are bad jackets - no solution for that. yes , a good printer will pack some more to get better pressure (and get another problem) but then you have more dot gain , more cylinder contact and problems.
Low quality ink ? cheap chemistry ? same - you are left with problems.
It is your press and your jobs & your clients - do what you like , but you can not change the facts.

I am not looking to sell you any new technology , i am simply pointing out that if your press is in perfect condition , it is easy to solve small problems , but when your press is in a bad condition , every small problem brings other problems when you try & bypass to solve.
Sorry , but no shortcuts in printing right .....endless shortcuts on printing wrong.

good luck

 

If you are using cheap materials, there is probably a lot of conflicts in the formulation. But that is understandable, we all have to work with what we have right?

Also true about overloading the ink. If you are using heavy inks to compensate for low dot gains you could be getting ink feedback in to the dampening system, especially with bad compatibility

You might not be able to get rid of this problem, but if you print a lot of the same paper size, you can cut your blanket packing to the size of your sheet.

If you print a lot of different size paper types, this will not be worth it. However, if you run quite a few jobs with almost the same paper size, you can cut your blanket packing to the largest size that you print, and, if anything, it will give you less work at the end of the day.

 

Agazi ,
what inks you use (from which company),the advice from Kaoticor is ok but only if you print on same size lot of jobs if not...

 

aqazi81
A cheap fix is to use oven cleaner on the jackets to clean off the harden stain ink. Now to pevent this in the furture, I think you have a few issues. Alcohol hardens the rollers,bad, chances are you need forms and or complete roller trains. You should look into etchs that are alcohol replacements, and phosphate free, it make a big difference in background tinting and picture framing. If you do go to a different etch, I would strongly recommend you change out as much of the hoses that carry the water to the trays, they all have slime going in them, with phosphate free you will not get a growth. Without alcohol your cheap ink should print better and look glossy for alcohol flatens out the ink, and chance are your water sweep will go down as long as your nips are right. Good luck
FSA

 

We are using Daihan Inks... Ultra series....
@FSA.. We use a similar type of material to clean the jackets if necessary....I have Printed Alcohol free in a different print shop for about two years... its a bit difficult to handle earlier, when you get used to it, then its almost the same as printing with alcohol.
have anyone used any consumables from ABC Chemicals?

 

I will be veru surprized if anyone in the western world knows the name of your ink - so can not comment on it , but if it is cheap - could be for a reason.
Alcohol free is excellent for your issue as then you get less water in your inbkj and you dry better - less scamming , but not every AF is the same.

I told you in the past - try Prisco , not any - try FC 3551Plus2 from Prisco
to clean your jackets , do not use "simikar" - use the right stuff (and as you know i do not sellk it so have no nerative) - use calsium fix from Bottcher

good luck

 

This is Korean printing inks so i don't know about their quality.