want to start print shop, what equipment for start ?

Mr. Nitewulf.... I went from leading a copier service company to open a copy shop and then small offset printing knowing nothing about offset. It is tough as many guys here had mentioned. Unless you have descent budget and willing to invest it to this - don't get started. Please keep in mind that anything you buy, in case it does not suit you, you will loose money, time and effort reselling it so buy wisely.
Lets start from the start
There should be PC and a Mac present.
PC quad core I7 with descent memory and screen- $349 PC from Staples in not going to cut it....
Mac does not have to be super top, I can say Mac G5 with 2 dual core processors and SSD harddrive serves me well.
Software - You will need some, Adobe surely, some plug-ins.
Guys, please chip-in about some order control/management software.
Press:
as mentioned before Heidelberg PM 46-2 is really good machine. You will need to get trained on that but since it is so popular it should not be so complicated to find someone who can help you with that. Please buy one that made after year 2000. It may cost you more the minute you buy but it is easier to operate that previous ones and easier to re-sell if you decide not to go for it.
Post press: What are your orders? You will need a cutter for 100%. Don't buy a toy or old machine, something in $10k range should be good. I have Polar-66 really nice machine. Don't forget that all these machines are heavy and will cost you a fortune to have them delivered and installed - this money you will never gain back if you change your mind about printing or purchase wrong item or decide to upgrade later so choose wisely. If you need folding - you will need folder. If your jobs are printed on glossy stock - has to air fed, friction-fed machine will not serve your needs. Booklets - saddle-stitcher. Having a digital duplicator is a good idea if you have jobs with text only. Would be nice if you could visit/spend some time at printing shop of the size and specialty that you see yourself in. I understand that next door competition will not let you do that but may be someone few hundred miles away will. We have lots of good guys here. You may spend 500-600 on hotel and meals but it is much better than buying equipment you had never used and don't have knowledge about.. how far are you from NY?

 

1 obvious thing missing in this, you may have computer, software and the press, but youll need a platemaker/imagesetter or platesetter to print anything on the press.. these alone cost £000s plus chemicals and materials ect ect ect.

 

The answers to your question are way too varied and lengthy to be dealt with here. The types of equipment you need depend on the market you are going after.Offset or Digital? Are you going to do your bindery in house or farm it out? How much space to you have available for storage of paper and equipment? Who is going to operate your machines?

 

Time/Hassle/Investment/

Should you really bother....? I am a 40yr veteran and have run my own print & design business for over 30 yrs.... I have loads of equipment yet I can still broker anything above 2k runs at a cheaper price.. therefore no Investment/Hassle/TImewasting... you need to do some serious number crunching as it seems that you haven't found the right suppliers.... ?

 

Don't let these folks discourage you.

Ok, now that everyone has tried to scare you away from your dream (although some points they make are valid) and tried to steer you towards partnering with another printer by outsourcing...

Let me tell you the downsides and MANY horrors that come from outsourcing to another printer and acting as a broker:

1. Getting pricing information to your customers is a total nightmare. Mostly because you'll have to wait so long getting information back and forth to your outsourcing partner. Any time any variable changes, from paper stocks, to sizes, to ink colors to be used, etc., more quoting nightmares. You want to be able to quote your customer on demand. And forget about a good price list. Most likely you'll quote a job and price list will be obsolete for whatever reason by the time you take the job to the printer.

2. You're 100% dependent upon the choices that the printing partner makes on everything. For instance, who they buy their paper from, what they will stock, what minimum inventory they will keep in stock. You may think to yourself that there's a good buy going on a certain paper right now but unless your printer partner is buying it forget it. You may be a better price negotiator than your printer but by buying from them you're paying more than they are. That happened to us years ago, I got better rates buying paper stock from my own paper suppliers than they were getting.

3. You are at the mercy of the quality standards and turn around times of your printing partners. Make no mistake, you may not be the top priority for that particular printer and your jobs may get pushed to the back of the line. I've had to wait weeks to months on some of the early partners that we fired. Also, if your job is too small or meaningless, you may not hear back from your sales rep at your partner printer...you're not important enough to bother with. It's amazing how many times I've had to send work back to multiple multi-generational "professional" printers with millions in equipment because of simple quality control errors; poor color shading, specks and lines on the papers...all obvious unacceptable problems.

4. Your new found printing outsource partner could just end up being your biggest competitor and enemy. Boy did I find that out the hard way. Oh don't worry, we won't compete with you or steal customers...rrrrrriiiiiight. Not only do you have to hope that your printer partner doesn't start marketing to your customer base but what happens when one of your customers gets a quote from both you and from your competing partner? Well you may just end up going bankrupt because you are now an irrelevant middle man taking a piece of the action. Oh and it doesn't have to be a local printing partner, with the internet your printing partner from across the country could end up being your biggest competitor.

5. Ok, so you should be afraid of getting too heavily invested in equipment and the huge learning curve of just starting out since many shops are closing...so what happens when you base your whole business on a print broker outsourcing model and your partner or partners go bankrupt...OOPS! There's so many variables that you can't control with your partners, financing, stealing, etc., etc., at least as your own company you control your expenses and marketing/sales efforts.

6. If you outsource, how is the finished product going to get to the customer? Are you going to have the printer partner drop ship the items without you checking the quality? What are the return policies on sh*tty work? Are you going to have the printed product delivered to your location and re-ship it to your customer with the added expense?

7. Ok, so let's say you find the perfect outsourcing partner and all goes well. What happens when prices change to a point where you can't be competitive or maintain your lifestyle? Will YOUR customers be ok with your vendors' price increases?

Also, look at the negative advice these guys are giving you and the positive advice. The positive advice comes from people looking to sell something, the negative advice comes from other printers, potential competitors or ones looking to sell to you in a broker fashion.

Are they correct, partly. Sure it is tough as hell for any industry, and yes there is tons of overcapacity. Is learning to run a press hard, maybe, anything you've never done before will be hardest at first, but it's not brain surgery or rocket science either. It's natural for an individual to hype up their job and the difficulty and skill level. I'm not saying it's a walk in the park or a piece of cake, but anything can be learned. The ease of which comes from how badly you want to learn and your level of devotion and passion.

Bottom line, if you want to make this happen you will work hard at it and be successful; even if you have to fail a few times. Look at Milton Hershey, he failed 3-4 times going on the verge of bankruptcy, but in the end he made a multi-billion dollar empire.

Remember, with devotion, willingness, and passion; things are easier to learn and you'll meet your goals quicker. Everyone here on this forum was once new or their companies started from nothing.

Just ask yourself how bad do you want it?

 

mr kingpd...
have you noticed the OP has not responded since 10/11?
And while some things you stated are true, copier sales reps tend to make this whole digital print thing out to be easy as just hitting print. Not So!
How many lines do you rep? Why? Because no one has "the" solution for everyone. How many times have you gone to buy a car and the dealership reps multiple brands - does it seem like they are just baiting you... it does me. If you have the desire to run two full time jobs and make money from both and not let either suffer then you are da man. Me, I just try to keep profitable until I can retire, which by my latest caluculation is 2 days before the next Ice Age.

 

Sales reps in general can be quite the liars...this is true.

However, when you are the sales rep, service tech, and partner in the firm...at least I, take a different sales strategy. I have to know a machine in and out and I may be able to sell it today but if I look bad or I'm going to have to throw parts at it left and right...I'm only taking money out of my own paycheck...

...that's why I do multiple lines of equipment. I'd rather cherry pick the tried and true machines rather than be loyal to just one brand...they all have good ones and doozies.

I can't vouch for or justify others selling practices, I can only control what I do.

The whole point was, the guy and future stumblers upon this thread shouldn't be scared off just because others are failing. And there are just as many excellent reasons as I have pointed out to NOT outsource, and rather do the work in house.

The big thing I would like to analyze is why so many printing companies have gone out of business...and just as interesting...why so many existing and start-up companies have grown and flourished at the same time others didn't.