The balance of ink and water(Understanding?)

[ims1985]

yes turbotom1052 the ink is extremely heavy but it lok pale not bright

 

[ims1985]

luke
you say alcohol act as a solvent and my ink look dissolved at the edges maybe the IPA is mixed with something else,i'll try another chemical company.

 

[luke]

Looking at your last photo's posted, It is obvious to see you have far to much fount feed on the ends which is traveling up into the ink rollers causing that emuslified mess...

Have you talked to your roller supplier to nut out the problem? And purchase a roller with zero crown and trial that on 1 deck. If it works you know what to do.

 

[ims1985]

i buy my rollers from Heidelberg egypt but there is few GTO 52 with Alcohol dampening system so they Imports the roller from Heidelberg German or Bottcher so
when i order a roller i get it after 10 or 14 days,two engineers from Heidelberg egypt came and checked the problem and they are not sure what is it but they suggests ot change my pan roller at both unit and change the dampening gears at unit 2 in fact i'm not sure if they are right.so i'm asking you for help.

 

[ims1985]

i did try IPA from another chemical company no change so i tried different fountain

solution no change,now i'm sure no problem with the IPA and the fountain solution I

use.now i'm going back to the rollers.

 

[ims1985]

no way that the new pan roller and the old one has the same problem with the same

range,so i changed the new pan roller by the old one and I see no different.

The only thing make a different when i moved the metering roller from unit 1 to

unit 2 i got this:

((the right side is ok))
------------------------------------------
when i put the metering roller back The situation returned as it was,then i changed roller settings between
metering roller and plate dampening roller from 5mm to 7mm
i got this:

((i have much water but Smoothly no dividing line on the left side))

now i'm going to test another plate dampening roller and see if there any change,
then i'm going to order a metering roller.

 

[turbotom1052]

I stand corrected

In an earlier post by me it's been pointed out by Luke that I was mixed up about crown in pan roller. Luke is right and I seem to have lost my place when posting. From the factory pan rollers have decreasing diameter on the ends to carry more water. You would want a pan roller that is more parallel on the ends. This will effectively squeeze more fountain solution out of the ends. Thanks Luke for clearing up my temporary brain fade.

 

[Loupeyeyed]

Can you skew your fountain roller on that press?

 

[print101]

I dont know if the real reason for the decrease in dia is to carry more water???

We always run our pan rollers with the crown (decrease at ends). The reason why we prefer it, is because when setting up you make contact in the middle first. You then continue to squeeze until the ends have a very thin film of water. This is all done by eye.

When we then run the press, we bring the water setting down to a min. If we notice we have catch-up on one end more than the other, we just give a little more water feed on the pan. This is obviously done when all other water rollers are perfectly set up.

You should never see large amounts of water on the pan, it should be a very thin amount across the whole roller. If it looks a though you have puddles / streaky amounts of water at the ends, this will defenately transfer into your inkers - cause you to over ink - thinking you lacking ink, emulsifying starts and you could possibly get yourself confused with other problems.

I would wash up, start again, and set that pan up with as little water as possible. Having catch-up will be a good sign, at least you wont be flooding the process. Then bring your water up until you clear the catch-up.

 

[steveo]

no skew

Can you skew your fountain roller on that press?

no skew on the heidy , hence the crowned roller....
seriously though mr ims if you havent gotten this cleared up in under an hour just by doing what print 101 said above theres something else radically wrong!
I dont mean to sound condesending but this is something that should go away by a little less ink , less water until you get your balance back , the minute you see too much ink film on your rollers is where you wanna cut back and maybe its gonna dry up a little , thats ok let that ink go away then decrease your water etc etc etc.....
the only time I can rememeber I had a strpping problem on a Man Roland ( in the cyan unit) I washed up repeatedly with vinegar and douched the water circulator as well figureing it just needed a good vinegar wash , but no dice finally I replaced every roller in the unit with the Man Roland demo guy ( who happened to be there) and no more stripping....but.....this was a rare incident so I guess what Im trying to say is you may have bad rubber in the press cause if you cant get this going like I said in under an hour....well you get the idea , I dont know what else to say....good luck and have a drink maybe

Steve

 

[mrheidelberg]

It is the rubber pan roller that has the crown.

 

[luke]

no skew on the heidy , hence the crowned roller....
seriously though mr ims if you havent gotten this cleared up in under an hour just by doing what print 101 said above theres something else radically wrong!
I dont mean to sound condesending but this is something that should go away by a little less ink , less water until you get your balance back , the minute you see too much ink film on your rollers is where you wanna cut back and maybe its gonna dry up a little , thats ok let that ink go away then decrease your water etc etc etc.....
the only time I can rememeber I had a strpping problem on a Man Roland ( in the cyan unit) I washed up repeatedly with vinegar and douched the water circulator as well figureing it just needed a good vinegar wash , but no dice finally I replaced every roller in the unit with the Man Roland demo guy ( who happened to be there) and no more stripping....but.....this was a rare incident so I guess what Im trying to say is you may have bad rubber in the press cause if you cant get this going like I said in under an hour....well you get the idea , I dont know what else to say....good luck and have a drink maybe

Steve

Steve,
Look back through his posts, he has set the roller as per the directions. No matter how tight he sets the nip it still has water flood either end of the pan roller.
He has posted what it looks like run with light ink film / medium ink film /heavy ink film. The results are the same everytime. I don't believe it is an ink water balance.

 

[steveo]

then what

I understand , its not that hard to put ink on paper....so that's why I said something is radically wrong.....only once in 30 years did I get stuck like that so I changed every roller in the unit...