Tale won't push in to clamp when hanging on fourth unit before perfect or any ideas?

Discussion in 'Komori Printing Presses' started by mondopronter, Feb 5, 2013.

  1. mondopronter

    mondopronter Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2012
    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    utah paragon press west valley
    When we hang plates on our lithrone forty inch eight color the fourth unit tail don't go all the way in the clamp?
     
  2. presselectronics

    presselectronics Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2011
    Messages:
    150
    Location:
    North America
    Is the clamp fully opening? Is the push bar coming on too quickly?
     
  3. Yorkshire Gripper

    Yorkshire Gripper Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 2012
    Messages:
    79
    Location:
    UK
    Is it full or semi APC?

    YG
     
  4. klecman

    klecman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2009
    Messages:
    171
    Location:
    New York
    Is the Circumferential register set to zero?
    Is the gripper edge fully inserted and resting on the pins?
     
  5. mondopronter

    mondopronter Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2012
    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    utah paragon press west valley
    is on pins, is full apc tail goes in just when wheels come forward to push it in it just comes up short about a sixteenth? I will see if its early but it seems like not enough presure
     
  6. presselectronics

    presselectronics Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2011
    Messages:
    150
    Location:
    North America
    Generally when they come up short I make sure the push bar comes on slowly - this is controlled by little needle valve "speed controllers". The wear out and the arm come up more quickly and tries to push the tail in too early. It gives the appearance that the plate is short. If that is not the problem I check packing. . .
     
  7. Komory

    Komory Member

    Joined:
    Jul 2010
    Messages:
    47
    Location:
    Моscow Russia
    is fault displayed?
    looks as the сlamp dirty or it is necessary to adjust the solenoid
     
  8. Meny

    Meny Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2008
    Messages:
    773
    Location:
    Israel
    what press is it ?

    is it a Lithrone ? LS ? GL ?
    all have different systems

    did you check air cylinders ? may be on that unit the cylinders are bad (water in pressed air issue ??)

    Meny
     
  9. mondopronter

    mondopronter Member

    Joined:
    Aug 2012
    Messages:
    10
    Location:
    utah paragon press west valley
    It's an ls 40p no fault shows. Need to check the speed and look at neumatic but we been dragging the first four all week so haven't used it.
     
  10. Meny

    Meny Senior Member

    Joined:
    Apr 2008
    Messages:
    773
    Location:
    Israel
    On LSit is rather clear (to me)

    On LSit is rather clear (to me)

    If a plate goe's wrong in at some time . and the bottom cover is just a little bent , the door opening mechanizem will work slower and so will the attached set of wheels pushing the tail in.
    It is like they become LAZY

    It is hard to see by eye if the internal mechanizem is bent , but if you take it apart and put it on your polar's table... it will be clear.

    LS - go this way

    I believe you will pnly need the sidepins that hold the flap - they are first to go bad , but not a big deal to replace. (only opoen them with the rigth tool or you will damage the screw heads (very tight)

    Good luck

    meny
     
  11. raypollock

    raypollock Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2008
    Messages:
    18
    Location:
    Belfast
    God there are some rubbish solutions here. So called Komori experts should stick to what they know.
     
  12. Yorkshire Gripper

    Yorkshire Gripper Senior Member

    Joined:
    May 2012
    Messages:
    79
    Location:
    UK
    What do you think it could be Ray?

    YG
     
  13. klecman

    klecman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2009
    Messages:
    171
    Location:
    New York
    If a picture is worth a thousand words, a video would be worth 100 thousand. Trying to solve a problem like this with only verbal information has to involve shooting in the dark - a brute force, trial and error problem solving method. There are scores of subtleties involved in a problem like this which would take an equal number of questions and answers to fully understand. I feel confident that if some of the members could see the problem in action, it would be solved in one or two posts.

    If I had stuck only to what I know, I would not have learned anything. On the other hand, discretion calls for not giving opinions without some basis in experience.
     
  14. raypollock

    raypollock Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2008
    Messages:
    18
    Location:
    Belfast
    Sorry for the delay in getting back but I was doing my job (fixing a Komori!) Firstly the pins that Meny (Eli Zamit) talked about do not 'go'. Well at least I have never replaced them or heard of them 'going' and I have worked as a Komori engineer for 17 years. Also as the plate is going on to the pins the cover will have nothing to do with it. The cover holds the flap and the flap inserts the plate onto the pins.
    I have seen this problem before several times.
    Once it was a faulty air piston.
    Once it was a faulty solenoid valve controlling the push wheels.
    I have seen problems with the manual adjustments on the plate clamp not being zeroed.
    I have seen the rollers become damaged by solvent and no longer provide even pressure on the plate. The last time I had this problem (2 weeks ago on a S840P) it was the position of the back edge push roller. I adjusted the position by unclamping the brackets at both op side and drive side and using a guage I made some years ago I set the position of the roller to the correct position.

    Ray
     
  15. presselectronics

    presselectronics Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2011
    Messages:
    150
    Location:
    North America
    Not constructive.

    presselectronics, "Generally when they come up short I make sure the push bar comes on slowly - this is controlled by little needle valve "speed controllers". The wear out and the arm come up more quickly and tries to push the tail in too early. It gives the appearance that the plate is short. If that is not the problem I check packing. . ."

    Constructive
     
  16. raypollock

    raypollock Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2008
    Messages:
    18
    Location:
    Belfast
    Opinion does not always equal fact. I try not to mistake my opinion for fact.
     
  17. klecman

    klecman Senior Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2009
    Messages:
    171
    Location:
    New York
    Probably the most common error in troubleshooting is reaching a conclusion before gathering sufficient facts through observation. Come to think of it, that's probably the most common error in life in general.
     
  18. junker1984

    junker1984 Senior Member

    Joined:
    Jan 2010
    Messages:
    801
    Location:
    US, Midwest
    Here, here, kleckman...constructive once again.
     

  19. wiseguy

    wiseguy Member

    Joined:
    Mar 2010
    Messages:
    21
    Location:
    europe
    Same problem

    On our ls 840 we had the same problem the pushbar came up too fast so we had to change the " speedcontrollers " - on two units. The plates were not correctly inserted into the clamp, on either side there was a few centimeters that was not in the clamp.

    wiseguy
     

Loading...