pm 52 feeding problem

Discussion in 'Heidelberg Printing Presses' started by tim enigma, Mar 25, 2011.

  1. tim enigma

    tim enigma Senior Member

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    i run a 2005 pm 52 2/c perfector. i have been running this press since it first came off the boat and have been the only pressman to ever run it. lately i cannot seem to get the press to feed well. i cannot get the little icon that shows if the sheet is slightly early or late to stay perfectly on time. it constantly goes back and forth no matter what i do. the feed tape is in good condition and the pull wheels are also in great condition. the eyeball sensors are nice and clean and no ink or dust build up anywhere. all filters for air pumps are brand new. the only thing that i have noticed is that the grippers on the bar that pulls the sheet into the press, the grippers on the drive side seem to have slightly less pressure than the operator side. would this cause this problem. are they easy to adjust. the press has 11 million impressions on it. it does this for any stock i feed through it form 60# book to 16 pt. for the most part all jobs seem to register fine but sometimes they do bounce slightly. any help is greatly appreciated. thanks
    tim
     
  2. exheidmech

    exheidmech Senior Member

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    Probably not the infeed grippers. How does the machine run when you put it in single sheet mode? If you see a difference in how it runs in single sheet mode vs stream feed mode, there could be a problem with a bearing on the drive side feeder area. There is a one way bearing I think its called a clutch in the parts book that I have seen go bad. When it starts to go bad you will have alot of trip offs at the feeder, hard time keeping feeder timing.
     
  3. tim enigma

    tim enigma Senior Member

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    honestly i have never run the press in single sheet mode. i will definatly try that and see what happens. thanks
    tim
     
  4. tim enigma

    tim enigma Senior Member

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    so i ran the press today in single sheet mode and the feeder timing was dead steady perfect. is the clutch bearing thing easy to fix? would it hurt the press any to just leave it in single sheet mode till we can get it fixed? any other ideas of what the problem could be? you wouldnt happen to know the part number for the clutch would you? thanks again
    tim
     
  5. exheidmech

    exheidmech Senior Member

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    Should be no problem running the machine in single sheet mode for as long as you like. Speed may need to be reduced to maintain register. As far as making the repair yourself, it could be a bit tricky. You will need to remove feeder chain, part of the single sheet/stream feed mechanism. Inside this mechanism is a sprocket with the overrunning clutch inside. You will also need to know how to reset feeder timing and reset feeder head timing. I would suggest not attempting this. Part # for overrunning clutch is 005500650.
     
  6. tim enigma

    tim enigma Senior Member

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    thanks a million. you have been a huge help.
    tim
     
  7. tim enigma

    tim enigma Senior Member

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    sorry to rehash this thread, but i got a few more questions. we had the overrider clutch replaced but this did not seem to fix the problem. its somewhat better on book stock but seems to be worse on cover stock even on single sheet. also the timing over all seems to be off. what degree should the press be at when the sheet hits the front lays? we are at 268 degrees but it shows way late sheets while running cover stock. also what should the forwarding wheels be set at. the tech set them at 2 mm away from the forwarding bar when the forwarding suckers let go of the sheet. however at this setting, the wheels do not touch at all and will not pull the first sheet off the pile. also what size is the adjuster to set feeder timing? i know the lock nut is 17mm but the tech who showed me how to set timing did not tell me what size the adjustment wrench is. sorry for so many questions but we seem to be going in reverse instead of fixing things.
    tim
     
  8. exheidmech

    exheidmech Senior Member

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    I would check your front allignment eyes and make sure those are correct. Also, reset feeder head timing to feeder. With the forwarding wheels completely down there should be a .10mm gap between the knurled screw and the wheel block. Also the sheet should be dropping from the forwarding suckers when the wheels are 1mm from the forwarding shaft.
     
  9. tim enigma

    tim enigma Senior Member

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    not sure how to check the eye alignment. i saw him check feed head to feeder timing and he said it was correct. maybe this is info that will help, when he first got it back together, and we tried to run some sheets, the side guide was coming down way before the sheet was at the head stops causing the sheet to jam. this is when he checked the timing and started to make changes. this is a pic of how badly it showed the timing was off when running. this was on 80# cover @ 8000 iph. this was the best i could get it. its funny, all these years and we have never had a lick of trouble with this press, now it seems to be going to hell in a hand basket. thanks again for all your help
    tim
     

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  10. dets2008

    dets2008 New Member

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    also drive wheels do shrink down after so many impressions ,affecting your timing,sheet travel,into your in feed,off the feed board,also the bearings,make sure your getting grease into the holes as well,on the in feed ,so many guys never check the grippers when doing maintenance,they do tend to seize up,on a six color heidelberg ,that's not good..
     
  11. tim enigma

    tim enigma Senior Member

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    thanks dets2008, im sure the drive wheels have shrunk some but have been re adjusted several times and deglazed regularly. the press is very well maintained and greased regularly and all gripper are working and free. since heidelberg recomends that the sheet hits the front lays at 268 degrees plus or minus 5 degrees. could i set the sheets to hit the front lays at 263 degrees and help the late timing? thanks
    tim
     
  12. exheidmech

    exheidmech Senior Member

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    How do you have your manual adjustment of the feeder timing adjusted? I think that if you have your manual adjustment centered and your feeder timing is set to 268 degress and you still have a late sheet, front allignment eyes need to be adjusted. This is not so easy on an SM52 since there really is no adjusting screw. Each eye is held in a dovetail clamp which needs to be loosened and then the eye slid forward or back then retightened. you can check the eyes by moving the headstops to 8mm gripper bite. Inch the press until the feeder is engaged, continue to inch until the headstop are all the way tword the feed board. Make sure the grippers have not closed yet. Put a sheet in the headstops and tape it to the feed board. You should have an indication on the MID that the front allignment eyes see the sheet. Now move the gripper bite forward from 8mm. Both eyes should turn off at approx the same time and somewhere between 9mm and 9.3mm. If this is not the case the eyes need to be adjusted.
     
  13. tim enigma

    tim enigma Senior Member

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    thanks exheidmech i will try this next time i am at the shop. the manual timing adjustment is as far advanced as i can move it and it is still as far off as in the pic i attached earlier. maybe even though the guy who was out and replaced the overrider clutch said he checked the feederhead to feed table timing maybe he didnt, or did but timed it wrong. the press was never this far out of time before the overrider clutch was replaced and the eyes have never been touched.
    tim
     
  14. exheidmech

    exheidmech Senior Member

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    Feeder head timing is also easy to check. Forwarding wheels should be 1mm above the forwarding shaft when forwarding suckers let go of the sheet. Ajustment is made behind door on DS of machine at the sprocket for feeder head drive shaft.
     
  15. dets2008

    dets2008 New Member

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    better off advancing the timing,see what happens,Also you should have a scew on there ,automatic or manual?motor might be gone ..
     
  16. tim enigma

    tim enigma Senior Member

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    i dont know what the scew is and am 99% sure this press does not have it. your not talking about the head stop movement right?
    tim
     
  17. dets2008

    dets2008 New Member

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    SCEW,feeder head

    Heidelberg,has motorized scew
     
  18. exheidmech

    exheidmech Senior Member

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    I think he means skew for the headstops, yes the press has it but when you skew the headstops the eyes move with it. Its the same motors used for adjusting gripper bite.
     
  19. dets2008

    dets2008 New Member

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    skew

    I was referring to the skew on top of the feeder head.,controls the sheet, down the feed board,either left or right,once going under the drive wheels,down the feed board.into your head stops,
     

  20. tim enigma

    tim enigma Senior Member

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    oh ok i understand what you mean now and no this press does not have a scew for the feed head. we did think of that though. thanks.
    tim
     
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