Kimori S226 2-color or Shinohara competetor?

We're a small publishing company specializing in graphic novels and are interested in obtaining a 2-color press. Our choices have been narrowed down to the Kimori S226 or it's competetor Shinohara. Would anyone happen to have the good, the bad, and the ugly on either of these presses to help in our decision?

 

Run a lot of print tests on the shinohara first to make sure it can actually print to your expected standard.. Don't want to purchase a machine then have to lower your customers standards because the machine can't print good work...

Now read into this anyway you like but this is a short list of what I have noticed on a 1996 2 colour shinohara and a 2007 4 colour shinohara both are 52's

1) Banding, can't print a solid without a band, poor water roller design and diameters..
2) feeder head and delivery not designed for high speeds
3) poor water roller layout, roller settings need to be re set a lot
4) auto roller wash system is pathetic with very limited adjustability one adjustment for all the decks,, means as the pipes are daisy chained some decks get starved of solvent or some get too much solvent
5) auto blanket wash works ok but runs of the same pump and tap settings that affect the roller wash
6) perfecting system design creates a lot of marking be it perfecting or straight mode printing
7) card thickness that it can print is limited
8) poor quality parts used on the machine
9) CIP3 profiles have limited adjustability. and accuracy is questionable.
10) plate clamps need reseting often (poly plates)

Heres a list of faults we had in the first 5 months of a brand new machine
1) main timming chain streched. had to be replaced
2) sheet timing adjustment bar snaped x 2 before we even used that adjustment.
3) no1 form + rider roller stop spining during washup (the newer machines have had a design change with some of the roller positioning creating this problem)
4)the main perfecting cam had all its bolts shear and smashed alll the tail gripers in the perfecting unit.. This was before we even used the perfecting system.
5) guard broke off the machine in the first week of its instalment when th tech lifted up the guard.
6) eventualy all 4 guards broke off the machine, they wern't even spot welded just a pin weld..
7) feeder head tilt systen continualy clicked up or down on the run.. took 6 go's at them getting this fixed.


Now would I recomend a shinohara,, no.....
If you are buying new but can't afford a real machine Heid /komori and you can afford a new shinohara ,, then purchase a second hand heid/komori,, you will be forever greatfull..

Pay the money and buy the enginering.... there is a reason why shino's are so cheap... the only thing solid on them is the frame everything else is weak or poorley designed..
If I could get my hands on a jap shino builder/tech I would strangle him..

And no Shinohara is not a real competitor too Komori.. yes maybee on the sales brochure it is... but what's written on that brochure and what it can actualy do properly is two totally different things..
Yes it can do a lot of things but none of them all that well

Now this is the shinohara 52 size I do belive the larger shinohara are actually built and designed better then the 52 series..

 

Shinohara??

A competitor to Komori, you're kidding right? Seriously, if you can't run to new get a good refurb from a Komori specialist reseller maybe ask your local Komori Dealer to point you in the right direction.

Sprint 226 or 226P (convertible perfector) make sure you go for a Komorimatic equipped machine with chiller/recirculator, makes life easier on makereadies and washups. Do what Luke suggests, print test with solids, check print length and make sure perfector works.

If you can stretch to it, a Lithrone is a better press, high pile delivery, 13k iph, Komorimatic as std, double size transfer (less sheet stress and no marking).

We're on our fourth Komori (L426, S226P, L428, L626emp), all were refurbs, all have performed exceptionally well. There are no perfect presses out there, they all have faults but I found over the last 37 years that they are the most reliable press I've ever used.

If you're printing 4 col work I'd really try to go for a Lithrone 426, even at 20 years old they come with semi-auto plate up and remote console, just make sure you get a 6 mth warranty to allow for teething issues.

Best o'luck

 

Can't go wrong with a Komori. (sorry mr. heidelberg)
If you buy a used one that is coming from a shop and its not a refurb one. Make sure to check it out. How clean it is and if there are dents in the cylinders.
If you're buying a used one that is at least from the late 90's. They should have the delta type dampeners. (hickey pickers)
Best type of dampeners out there.

Anyways....make sure to check any used press out.

 

Dear Luke

I am planning to buy a 2008 model Shinohara 52/4 because of its price. But after I read your comments on it, I had some doubts on it. Could you give some advice on it? My email is saltik_43@hotmail.com

 

I will be simple & clear

The Shino's have never been good machines , just about OK , nothing more.
Now that the company had gone under and no more company back up, buying a Shino is buying a used press that was never good , now used and has no support , parts.....
Is this what you want ?
Cheap ?
Right , so are some presses that are built in China , India and so on.

Buy a Komori - and your are good
Buy a Heidelberg and you are fine
Buy a cheap Shino.....and say by by to your money , and could be in due time to your business....

I would not get close to it

Good luck

 

Thanks Meny. I understand your points but the money...

I am still dubious because the prices of Komori and Heidelberg are far above my budget. While I can find Shinohara for 65000 euros, Komori and Heidelberg start from 120000 or even higher. However, I don't want to spend my money on garbage, neither.

One more question:

Shinohara 52/4 or Ryobi 524 HXX??? Which one do you suggest? Is Ryobi a better brand than Shinohara?

 

Yes , for sure.
Ryobi is a big name for small presses and it is naking machines full steam ahead,
you should consider cost of parts that is not cheap and the quality is not the best but better vise Shinohara.

For 65000 Euro you can get a nice Komori or a Heidrlberg , and then you will be better off for years.
Feel free to consult me on presses if you want a good yet cheap Komori

 

Actually it will be nice if you can help me finding machine; thanks for that. Which kind of Komori or Heidelberg can you offer me for this price? Heidelbergs or Komoris between this price are older models, I think, with no auto-plate, no washing devices etc. If you can give your e-mail, or can write to my mail, I'd like to take more advice from you. my e-mail: saltik_43@hotmail.com.