Heidelberg SM 102 Alcohol Question

[amitabhbansal]

Friends
I just have started my printing unit and i have SM 102 Alcohol Dampning.
I want to know whether we can run the machine without alcohol or not? and why? what will be effect on printing and on machine.
Thanks

 

[turbotom1052]

running alcohol free

running without alcohol can be a challenge to someone whos never done it. if youve got a seasoned pressman with a good attention to detail, and a press in decent shape with good rollers then running alcohol free would actually be prefered. the steps required are too numerous to list here but you can pm me if you like and we can arrange to talk on the telephone. ive done this with much success and am well versed in alcohol free printing

 

[all alone]

Hi all....
I operate a Heidelberg 52 4 colour with Baldwin cooling and alcolor damping. My Z rollers are intergrated in the damping. I use 10% alcohol in the cooling system. The problem is that my Damping form roller gets excessive ink transfered onto it during the run and this happens soon after the run starts. I know what people are going to say regarding to much ink been released onto the rollers but trust me that isn't the problem. This problem gets alot worst when i am using spot colours and not process ink. The more this roller gets a build up of ink on it, the harder the transfer of ink from plate to blanket becomes and the images becomes washed out looking. The ink i am using is Hostmann-Steinberg. I also add in my damping 0.5% of a water hardening agent (Salinofix / Hostmann) and damping additive Combifix-xl (Hostmann) 4% which gives me a Ph value of 5. I have had a lab test my solution and they say it's fine. I have replaced all the ink form rollers and the damping rollers with new original Heidelberg rollers have reset them using a good heidelberg engineer. All areas of this problem have been looked at i think but hoping that this might have happened to someone out there and the solution is on hand.
Thanks all.

 

[turbotom1052]

i think you may be mixing up the difference between alcohol dampening and alcolor dampening. alcolor is the patented name for heidelbergs continuos flow water system. this system can be run with or without alcholol. if you must use alcohol to print id suggest no more than 5 to 6 %. if you need any more than that then theres something wrong with either your press or your pressman. if its your pressman that lacks experience then dig into your pocket a little deeper and start paying your help a fair wage.

 

[steveo]

"if its your pressman that lacks experience then dig into your pocket a little deeper and start paying your help a fair wage. "

amen brother!!

 

[Guest 82818-824]

If the pressman is inexperianced no amount of money is going to make him experianced!

 

[steveo]

so true ..I see a lot of newer pressman coming up who never had the opportunity to serve an apprenticeship with a good pressman or crew , you can put a lot of guys on a fully automated press to watch a job but when theres a problem they just dont have the skills to get out of trouble....Ive been fortunate to always earn an excellent wage...

Steve

 

[Guest 82818-824]

so true ..I see a lot of newer pressman coming up who never had the opportunity to serve an apprenticeship with a good pressman or crew , you can put a lot of guys on a fully automated press to watch a job but when theres a problem they just dont have the skills to get out of trouble....Ive been fortunate to always earn an excellent wage...

Steve

Unfortunatly this is becoming more and more frequent. With press manufacturers pushing towards a one button automated start up and as technology becomes more and more reliable employers are more and more willing to spend the money on the press and not on the pressman.

 

[timc]

so true ..I see a lot of newer pressman coming up who never had the opportunity to serve an apprenticeship with a good pressman or crew , you can put a lot of guys on a fully automated press to watch a job but when theres a problem they just dont have the skills to get out of trouble....Ive been fortunate to always earn an excellent wage...

Steve

thats the truth Anyone can run a press Its knowing what to do to get it running and keep it that way

 

[turbotom1052]

wages

If the pressman is inexperianced no amount of money is going to make him experianced!

when i say dig into your pocket and pay a better wage im talkin bout making the job desirable salary wise for an experienced pressman to come in and be more than a button pusher. your right your never gonna make a a turd pressman better by paying him more

 

[steveo]

Ive been running a 102 recently and theres no alcohol in the shop , but it pays to take a few minutes and check the roller settings , maybe even on a daily basis if your in a 3 shift shop , every one likes to touch things at night for some reason but Im telling you I have no scumming problems and keep my water speeds fairly low by taking the time to reset the damps...like tom said pay attention to what your doing , this alcolor system runs fine w/o alcohol....