inks don't seem to dry as well

Discussion in 'Ink' started by mmpar, Nov 3, 2008.

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  1. mmpar

    mmpar New Member

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    has anyone had ink drying problem lately
    a lot of the offset printers in the new york, new jersey area are all having the same drying problems.
    most of us run uncoated stocks
    thanks
    frank
     
  2. 5150pressman

    5150pressman Senior Member

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    Are you running the skin free type inks???
    I noticed on the skin free inks. Its drys good on coated stock. It does seem to have a problem on uncoated. I put a little drier in the inks and that helps.
     
  3. socrates

    socrates Member

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    Maybe something in the water has changed so you need to alter your pH settings meaning if the pH of the water has changed to more, and you keep adding the same amount of pH agent, you are printing on higher pH levels thus your ink doesnt dry fast enough or at all. If you printed on coated stock it wouldnt be that apparent.
     
  4. luke

    luke Senior Member

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    So many varibles..
    Few things to check.
    1) check your PH/conductivity of your fount to make sure it's still correct.
    2) check with your ink supplier to make sure that they haven't changed the make up of the ink at all.
    3) check that the substrate your printing on is in fact that the same that you have always printed on.


    If a few stores are having the same issue, most likely all are using different chemistry/inks but highly likely their all using the same substrate from the same vendor, + the same water...
    We use RO water and add a hardner, that way we know it's consistant day in day out..

    What brand ink are you using? there is a certain brand over there that has been having issues due to a change within the ink manufacturing. (H/S)
     
  5. emmet

    emmet Member

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    I had similar problems for me a ph of 4.9 and conductivity of around 1400 work well if you buy a ph and a conductivity tester your problems will probably go away a test from your ink tech service will give you a starting point and you can test yourself after that also if running a technotrans or something like that weekly cleaning gives better results in our case the ink company sent their chemist he set the ph and now we are finishing jobs within an hour of printing ,hope this helps
     
  6. Guest 82818-824

    Guest 82818-824 Previous User

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    Has a new sales rep in the area tried to push a starch based anti set-off spray powder onto you?
     
  7. 4 color GTO

    4 color GTO Member

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    I put Grapho dryer in all uncoated jobs that get any kind of bindery. I run lots of heavy "rich" 4color black solid builds on uncoated, cut down to b.c. size with no offset whatsoever. Don't skimp on it either, not enough won't work, about two oz.to the pound.
     
  8. Question

    Question New Member

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    Ink additve and conditioner

    I have heard that we can add dryer, wax, antiskin into printing ink in order to make them fast dry and scuff resistance, can any one tell me what is the product name?
     
  9. socrates

    socrates Member

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    I wouldn't add anything in the ink, if I were you. Check your conductivity first or/and you ph value. Adding stuff will make things worse
     
  10. Question

    Question New Member

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    Thanks to Socrates. and what value of PH is the best and How to check it?
     
  11. ziggy33

    ziggy33 Senior Member

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    best value of ph is in between 4.5 and 5.5. I like to keep it at 5 so it has some play to go up or down. You need to get some ph test strips which your lithograph supplier should have. The product I use in my ink to make my ink dry faster is Van son smooth lith it works great for me.
     
  12. Print Consultant

    Print Consultant Member

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    Always check the chemistry first, Most print related problems can be solved very quickly by making sure everything is ok with the chemicals. Invest in a meter to chech pH & conductivity.
     
  13. topper

    topper Member

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    Question. You will find that the majority if not all fountain solutions are buffered. This means no matter how much etch you mix into your tank the PH will not go below say a 3.7. However you will see that your conductivity will fluctuate greatly. I have found with working with many printers that a good starting point on fountain mix is typically 1000 points of conductivity over your begining. Example: incoming tap is 600um mix your water and etch to 1600 at 4.0ph. These aren't hard and fast just a good starting point. Also the same holds true for cleaning your tanks. When your fountain solution rises to say 2600- 2800um time to change them out and start fresh.
     
  14. steveo

    steveo Senior Member

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    Ive used liquid cobault in my fountain sollution , dont like to make adds to the ink as I think most offset inks lately seem to work well on most substates....
    try a moderate amount of IR ,Dont overdo it with the heat and have your floor help wind the loads after 1st pass.......
    Where do you print in NY/NJ ? I havent heard of anyone having drying issues....and god knows theres enough ink vendors around!!
     
  15. Miehleman

    Miehleman Member

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    Allied has a product called X+Y,it is a light paste that comes in a tube,one tube is X other is Y,you squeeze equal amounts mix it together then add to ink.As a good starting point 1" of X+Y to a pound of ink
    Happy printing
     
  16. Frank T Sullivan III

    Frank T Sullivan III Member

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    Here is a little something no one has mentioned yet. Putting ink back into the can after a run can cause the ink to pick up more water each time its used (emulsify ). This means the ink will take longer to dry also you might notice toning issues or the color just looks weak and does not come up to color. This is something that most printers will say I
    only do that sometimes or only on black but never on colors. This one is easily solved by just opening a fresh can of ink and see if the ink is running better.

    Another thought is room temperature. With the high cost of heating a building most printers will really turn that temperature down at night. That slows the drying of ink because the water that is accepted onto the sheet along with the ink has to absorb into the paper or evaporate into the air. For small shops I just suggest a little space heater blowing warm air on the piles can really help.

    Also people already mentioned drier most oil base lithographic inks come with about 3 % drier in the ink already. Well as you know in the winter we could use a bit more drier but ink companies do not have a winter and summer formula. So you need to do a little press side addition. Most ink companies will tell you a 1/4 to a 1/2 an ounce per pound is the recommended addition. Adding 1/2 oz per pound is like adding an additional 3 % so the total is 6 % drier maximum. To much drier has the opposite effect and can actually slow the drying process.

    I sell ink and developed the MixMaster software program that recycles excess colors when you mix, give us a try.
    www.mixmasters.com for software free trials or www.mminks.com for ink samples and prices. 1800 332 9321
     
  17. hockojr

    hockojr Member

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    problems with drying on a wax coated stock. Tried a dryer called Foil dryer at 20 % this dried the work but left the chrome damper distributor covered in a thick matt film. Which is hard to clean . any body used this foil dryer its a pink colour and skins quick in the in tin. U K
     
  18. pjnestor

    pjnestor Member

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    I found it usually lies with the fountain solution. I've also noticed sometimes it depends on the weather. Used to work in one print shop in Alaska and the heat wasn't very good in the building, sometimes three days would go by and some of the business cards weren't even dry enough to cut! But if that's not even a factor, the next bet is your fountain solution. If you are using tap water it might be wise to test the ph of that water before you add your solution and then adjust your formula. I'm sure you know this, PH means potential for hydrogen. On a scale of one to 14, 7 is neutral. It's time to break out some ph strips, it's easy to get complacent especially if you've always used the same formula for so long, but it's always good to check when things go south. We also used to use some citric acid to lower PH instead of using more of the fountain solution because that fountain solution can really mess with conductivity also. One Printer told me he used just plain old baking soda. Never tried that, but just thought I'd pass it on.
     
  19. pjnestor

    pjnestor Member

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    I have seen that where some Printer's will put ink back into the can, makes me cringe, it's right up there when they take the water out of the fountain and put it right back into their water bottle. Contamination is often overlooked and not at all taken seriously, except by me because I'm a type A personality in a profession full of B's!
     

  20. labelprintingservice

    labelprintingservice New Member

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    I'm also having the same problem, thanks I got lot of information over here. Update you later on after trying these tips.
     
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