New Impression Cylinders?

Discussion in 'Heidelberg Printing Presses' started by sales.hkltd, Oct 8, 2011.

  1. sales.hkltd

    sales.hkltd New Member

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    Hey guys,

    just have a question for some of the experts on the forum. We have a SM74 that has a damaged impression cylinder. I know that you can try to repair it, but is it possible to replace the cylinder itself? Where can we get such cylinders? anywhere?

    Thanks in advance
     
  2. Meny

    Meny Senior Member

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    Yes it is possible.
    No . i do not think it is cost effective....
    replacing a cylinder is a big job and the cost will be very high once you need to buy a new one - it is not a cheap toy.
    I do not know the damage on your press , but if it is that bad that you must change the cylinder , i would assume the cylinder is not the only damage and the cost will yet be higher.
    what model is your press ? what cylinbder is damaged ? number of units ?

    Good luck - i think it is best simply to fix the one on press...
     
  3. sales.hkltd

    sales.hkltd New Member

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    Thank you for your reply. We were just wondering at the possibility. We are just looking if there are any suppliers for the impression cylinder.Its a SM74 around 95. We think we can take the cylinder out. Of course, we also know the cylinder will be expensive... :(
     
  4. Meny

    Meny Senior Member

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    Impression cylinder ? Blanket cylinder ?
    An impression cylinder can cost you any thing between 25000-30000 Euroand the job can take a week or more.
    If you had a realy big BANG you could need some gears and more.
    What was on the other side of that cylinder ? is that cylinder damage free ?
    can you upload a photo of the damage and tell me how it happend ? paper jam ? screw ? bolt ? tool ?
    Any damage to the bearings ? bearing housing ?
     
  5. KomEng

    KomEng New Member

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    There is a cylinder repair specialist works out in Hong Kong a lot but live in the UK, He may be able to repair or recommend someone more local, His name is giles Tallot,
    00441132328980
    00447831651483
     
  6. exheidmech

    exheidmech Senior Member

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    If your impression cylinder has a ding or dent or a small to medium depression it can be fixed in press. Usually the only reason why a cylinder need to be replaces if it is bent. To bend a SM74 impressionn cylinder usually requires a pretty big crash. Ive seen it where a small pile of cover stock or board gets caught between the blanket or impression cylinder. Also an improperly installed blanket wash towel can produce the same results. My first suggestion would be to indicate the cylinder before you hire anyone to do any repairs. Find out if its bent or just dinged. As already noted cylinder replacement is not cheap. Usually if you bend an impression cylinder likely the blanket cylinder needs to be replaced as well. I would suggest replacing all 4 bearing bolts as well. If there was enough force to bend an impression cylinder, no doubt it broke at least the upper bearing bolts possibly the lower ones as well. You will likely also have to replace the cylinder bearings on both the impression cylinder and blanket cylinder. These bearings are tollerance bearings and have to be hand fit to your specific machine. Also, I dont know what kind of access you have around your machine but a gantry or a forklift will be needed to assist with removal of the side frame and the cyinlinders, usually from the operator side, but can be done from the drive side as well. I have never heard of anyone manufacturing after market cylinders, and if anyone did I dont think I would even think of putting one in my machine knowing all the is involved in replacing these cylinders. This is not something you want to do twice. Once you get your cylinder indicated and find the actual runout of the impression and blanket cylinder please post.
     
  7. KomEng

    KomEng New Member

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    There is a much simpler non engineering way to test your cylinders are Ok or not, set your pressure on the unit you want to test to .1 and print with a dry solid, then .2 then .3 then .4 and you will see if the cylinder is bent or not, this will also show up low places that are damaged and require filling by a cylinder repair person. you can also use car body repair paste as a temporary repair
     
  8. exheidmech

    exheidmech Senior Member

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    Yes, doing a breakaway solid will reaveal low areas printed on a sheet. However this will not reaveal which of the 3 cylinders are producing the non printed area. This can only be done with a dial indicator. I have also heard of guys using body filler to repair damaged cylinders but only if maybe a nut, bolt, wrench, ball bearing have gone through the press, not a bent cylinder. SM74 cylinders are chrome and body filler is not going to like to stick to that cylinder surface. For bent impression cylinders the cheapest fix can be done if the machine is a perfector and the cylinder in question has a jacket on it. I have heard of using spray paint to fill the low areas and then reinstall the jacket. This really can only be doine if your cylinder is maybe .15mm out. My suggestion rent a dial indicator from a machine shop or get a mechanic in to indicate your cylinders. If your runout is not that bad you may have a few options if this cylinder has a jacket on it. If there is no jacket there are not many options available.
     
  9. sales.hkltd

    sales.hkltd New Member

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    Thanks for all the input. We just have a huge damage on the cylinder and we are seeing what damages are there. We will see what options we have from the suggestions, but what is a way of getting an impression cylinder, if any? from heidelberg?
     
  10. exheidmech

    exheidmech Senior Member

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    Yup from Heidelberg, thats pretty much it.
     
  11. saso777

    saso777 Senior Member

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    Contact Heidelberg or company that represent them
     
  12. Chris.PressLifeLLC

    Chris.PressLifeLLC New Member

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    Are you still looking to get your SM74 impression cylinder replaced?

    I am a former Heidelberg Service Tech. We are gearing up to do exactly what you are talking about. We are going to replace a Imp cyl and Blanket cyl due to serious damage. We have the cylinders and can give you pricing on cylinder costs and labor required to do the job. Cylinder price well below Heidelberg's 35,000 Euro. Talked to Heidelberg Tech who said it took them 2 1/2 weeks. Outrageous! 13 days at most, 9 days at least.

    As far a cost effective as others mentioned. It is expensive, but depending on how bad it's damaged sometimes it's the only option. In-press cylinder repair is for dents and dings and won't make a cylinder run true again if it's no longer running concentric. This will give you print length problems. Generally if it's with .02-03 mm you can have succes with adjusting packing. .04 mm and beyond forget it. The differences in squeeze on the sheet will give you too many problems.
     
  13. Atleng

    Atleng New Member

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    What are the OEM run out tolerances on impression and blanket cylinders on an SM74?
     
  14. exheidmech

    exheidmech Senior Member

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    Anything under .02mm is likely not going to be noticeable on your print. If your asking what are the tolerances on a machine leaving the factory, it is zero.
     
  15. Atleng

    Atleng New Member

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    exheidmech,
    Thank you.
    Zero is a very tight tolerance for manufacturing :)
    I expect it will be +/- 0.0?mm
     
  16. exheidmech

    exheidmech Senior Member

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    There may be a +/- tolerance, but it is likely in microns and I dont know what that is. Every cylinder I have indicated on a newer machine has had zero runout on my .01 mm dial indicator.
     

  17. Atleng

    Atleng New Member

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    Thank you.
     
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